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Thread: Option Offense

  1. #191

    Default Re: Option Offense

    Quote Originally Posted by eaglewraith View Post
    What App ran under Satterfield was a hair breadth away from being a triple option offense. Hell they actually ran option better than we did in 16/17.

    They also remembered that you have to have an effective and efficient passing game. And their offense actually encouraged a passing game.

    They are literally about to be back in the top 25, and if they win this week could potentially be the first SBC team to be ranked in the CFP rankings, after being the highest AP ranked SBC team. The inertia from all that doesn't just go away, you ride it and it helps you when you do stumble to be able to make it back up. I'm liking what they're doing and what they've built for a lot more than how we're looking right now. I get that we have personnel issues and I've been a big advocate for patience with the OL issues, however we're not scheming around our issues either it seems. And we don't really have an answer right now for when our ground game is shut down....we just don't.

    I love being a heavy run based team....but we've got to get better at passing the ball too. And it needs to be more a part of our offense instead of just a novelty. That's the only way you're going to recruit more skilled QBs and actually hang onto the talent you get at WR. We do a good job of getting WRs here but then they leave after they get 1 pass a season.
    I don't think anyone disagrees that we have to make defenses respect our passing game. Can't argue with your thoughts here.

  2. #192

    Default Re: Option Offense

    Quote Originally Posted by straightshooter View Post
    I'd take the Fritz offense with 15 or so passes a game thrown in. Still run dependent, but enough passing to open up the run game a bit more.
    That’s what we saw on Saturday, isn’t it?
    Thanks, Rastabot!
    www.247sports.com/porkchops

  3. #193

    Default Re: Option Offense

    Quote Originally Posted by GATAlac El Dorado View Post
    This is the biggest disconnect every time this debate comes up.

    Someone says “The flex would continue to work well consistently at GS” and everyone hears “The flex is infallible and is the only way to win here or anywhere”. I don’t think I’ve ever heard even the most ardent flexboner suggest that.
    Exactly.

  4. #194

    Default Re: Option Offense

    Quote Originally Posted by eaglewraith View Post
    What App ran under Satterfield was a hair breadth away from being a triple option offense. Hell they actually ran option better than we did in 16/17.

    They also remembered that you have to have an effective and efficient passing game. And their offense actually encouraged a passing game.

    They are literally about to be back in the top 25, and if they win this week could potentially be the first SBC team to be ranked in the CFP rankings, after being the highest AP ranked SBC team. The inertia from all that doesn't just go away, you ride it and it helps you when you do stumble to be able to make it back up. I'm liking what they're doing and what they've built for a lot more than how we're looking right now. I get that we have personnel issues and I've been a big advocate for patience with the OL issues, however we're not scheming around our issues either it seems. And we don't really have an answer right now for when our ground game is shut down....we just don't.

    I love being a heavy run based team....but we've got to get better at passing the ball too. And it needs to be more a part of our offense instead of just a novelty. That's the only way you're going to recruit more skilled QBs and actually hang onto the talent you get at WR. We do a good job of getting WRs here but then they leave after they get 1 pass a season.
    We need to do what we did throwing the ball on Saturday about half the time—except for the sacks. The plays we didn’t get sacked were the kind of production we need out of our passing game if we are going to score enough points to win this league.

    We might get by with less production in the passing game if we run for 380+ YPG and 6.5 YPC. However, I’m not sure that’s gonna happen any time soon.
    Thanks, Rastabot!
    www.247sports.com/porkchops

  5. #195

    Default Re: Option Offense

    Quote Originally Posted by eaglewraith View Post
    What App ran under Satterfield was a hair breadth away from being a triple option offense. Hell they actually ran option better than we did in 16/17.

    They also remembered that you have to have an effective and efficient passing game. And their offense actually encouraged a passing game.

    They are literally about to be back in the top 25, and if they win this week could potentially be the first SBC team to be ranked in the CFP rankings, after being the highest AP ranked SBC team. The inertia from all that doesn't just go away, you ride it and it helps you when you do stumble to be able to make it back up. I'm liking what they're doing and what they've built for a lot more than how we're looking right now. I get that we have personnel issues and I've been a big advocate for patience with the OL issues, however we're not scheming around our issues either it seems. And we don't really have an answer right now for when our ground game is shut down....we just don't.

    I love being a heavy run based team....but we've got to get better at passing the ball too. And it needs to be more a part of our offense instead of just a novelty. That's the only way you're going to recruit more skilled QBs and actually hang onto the talent you get at WR. We do a good job of getting WRs here but then they leave after they get 1 pass a season.
    What it comes down to is "What kind of QB to you want to recruit?" That IMO is probably the biggest conundrum of any option coach right now trying to compete in DI.

    If you have a guy like Chandler Burks and Jaybo Shaw in order to be "balanced" in the passing game you will pay for it in the option game because you have to hold blocks on the edge a lot longer for them to makes plays on the perimeter unlike with guys like Shai Werts Jerick McKinnon. I've seen more than a few plays that guys like Shai Werts and McKinnon can turn into 5-10 yard gains that are minimal gains with a "standard" dual-threat QB. That means you could be sacrificing athleticism at A-back in exchange for good blocking ability to make it work.

    IMO, we should continue to recruit athletes at QB (i.e. the way we always have) and put the guy in there that can run the option game well and has a decent arm. In my mind, the offensive statistics for 2012 versus 2011 show that that model is superior than recruiting a QB specifically for "passing balance". IMO 2015 also showed you can still score points with a limited passing game so long as you have a good OL (and I consider it realistic we can have a line that talented every season). You need a guy that can at least complete some of the passes to one-on-one matchups downfield but you don't need a guy that can watch 4 receivers and anticipate which one is going to come open.

    And for the guys that would say "you can recruit A-backs that are athletic and can block and you can recruit guys that are athletic as Werts that can throw". Doesn't work like that.
    Last edited by BillyBob; 12th November 2019 at 10:34 AM.
    "Follow the trendlines, not the headlines." -Steven Pinker (?)

    Regarding football Scheduling.

  6. Default Re: Option Offense

    Quote Originally Posted by BillyBob View Post
    What it comes down to is "What kind of QB to you want to recruit?" That IMO is probably the biggest conundrum of any option coach right now trying to compete in DI.

    If you have a guy like Chandler Burks and Jaybo Shaw in order to be "balanced" in the passing game you will pay for it in the option game because you have to hold blocks on the edge a lot longer for them to makes plays on the perimeter unlike with guys like Shai Werts Jerick McKinnon. I've seen more than a few plays that guys like Shai Werts and McKinnon can turn into 5-10 yard gains that are minimal gains with a "standard" dual-threat QB. That means you could be sacrificing athleticism at A-back in exchange for good blocking ability to make it work.

    IMO, we should continue to recruit athletes at QB (i.e. the way we always have) and put the guy in there that can run the option game well and has a decent arm. In my mind, the offensive statistics for 2012 versus 2011 show that that model is superior than recruiting a QB specifically for "passing balance". IMO 2015 also showed you can still score points with a limited passing game so long as you have a good OL (and I consider it realistic we can have a line that talented every season). You need a guy that can at least complete some of the passes to one-on-one matchups downfield but you don't need a guy that can watch 4 receivers and anticipate which one is going to come open.

    And for the guys that would say "you can recruit A-backs that are athletic and can block and you can recruit guys that are athletic as Werts that can throw". Doesn't work like that.
    I know that the coaches were excited and thought they had what they wanted at QB with the kid from Louisville, who was a big strong kid that could run and throw. He was not a Shai Werts type guy, but was the type guy they wanted to build the offense around. They thought he was gonna be really special. Maybe I've missed it, but there doesn't appear to be anyone on our recruiting radar like him. Correct me if that's wrong. We need to keep up the faith though because when we get that one "GUY" it will change everything.

  7. #197

    Default Re: Option Offense

    Quote Originally Posted by pete4256 View Post
    We need to do what we did throwing the ball on Saturday about half the time—except for the sacks. The plays we didn’t get sacked were the kind of production we need out of our passing game if we are going to score enough points to win this league.

    We might get by with less production in the passing game if we run for 380+ YPG and 6.5 YPC. However, I’m not sure that’s gonna happen any time soon.
    The passing will help make that 300 ypg rushing total happen. Sacks were disturbing to say the least. OL has to shore that up and QB has to get rid of the ball quicker. WR have to run crisp routes, make cuts and get separation - ball has to be thrown on time though. Easier said than done, but that's the process.....

  8. #198

    Default Re: Option Offense

    Quote Originally Posted by BillyBob View Post
    What it comes down to is "What kind of QB to you want to recruit?" That IMO is probably the biggest conundrum of any option coach right now trying to compete in DI.

    If you have a guy like Chandler Burks and Jaybo Shaw in order to be "balanced" in the passing game you will pay for it in the option game because you have to hold blocks on the edge a lot longer for them to makes plays on the perimeter unlike with guys like Shai Werts Jerick McKinnon. I've seen more than a few plays that guys like Shai Werts and McKinnon can turn into 5-10 yard gains that are minimal gains with a "standard" dual-threat QB. That means you could be sacrificing athleticism at A-back in exchange for good blocking ability to make it work.

    IMO, we should continue to recruit athletes at QB (i.e. the way we always have) and put the guy in there that can run the option game well and has a decent arm. In my mind, the offensive statistics for 2012 versus 2011 show that that model is superior than recruiting a QB specifically for "passing balance". IMO 2015 also showed you can still score points with a limited passing game so long as you have a good OL (and I consider it realistic we can have a line that talented every season). You need a guy that can at least complete some of the passes to one-on-one matchups downfield but you don't need a guy that can watch 4 receivers and anticipate which one is going to come open.

    And for the guys that would say "you can recruit A-backs that are athletic and can block and you can recruit guys that are athletic as Werts that can throw". Doesn't work like that.


    Big difference between Chandler Burks and Jaybo as runners, though. Neither were fast, but Burks was an effective power runner (think Chaz as a senior) who consistently got yards and scored a ton of touchdowns.

    If I were recruiting QBs, I’d look for the most dynamic sub 6’1” QBs I could sign, as long as they had the minimum athletic ability to get yards on read option plays.

    This means that they could be really effective passers (think Seth Shuman or Jaybo Shaw, both of whom are right at the cut-off for being athletic enough to make plays on read option), or really explosive runners (think McKinnon, Jayson).

    If we sign enough of them, develop them adequately, and scheme to their strengths, we will be fine.

    A good OC should be able to tailor this or a similar offense around any explosive QB.

    I’m always skeptical of tall QBs, because every team in the country scouts a tall QB. If they’re dynamic throwers, they can play for anybody. If they are dynamic runners, they can play WR for almost anybody. Go look at the footage for “Gregory Spann” and ask yourself whether we have a chance in hades of signing him. Go look at Jaden Jenkins film and tell me that most recruiters didn’t know about his medical condition. That’s the reason we signed him.

    However, if we focus on dynamic QBs, we should be able to compete for the shorter ones. And if we’re real lucky, a Tracy Ham or Russell Wilson might fall through the cracks to us. We should EXPECT to get Greg Hills, Kevin Ellisons, and J.R. Reveres year-in and year-out.
    Last edited by pete4256; 12th November 2019 at 11:02 AM.
    Thanks, Rastabot!
    www.247sports.com/porkchops

  9. #199

    Default Re: Option Offense

    Quote Originally Posted by straightshooter View Post
    The passing will help make that 300 ypg rushing total happen. Sacks were disturbing to say the least. OL has to shore that up and QB has to get rid of the ball quicker. WR have to run crisp routes, make cuts and get separation - ball has to be thrown on time though. Easier said than done, but that's the process.....
    Yeah, and it’s possible we need to re-design our passing concepts and spend more time working on the passing game.

    If Jayson Foster could complete 70% of his passes for over 100 ypg, anyone should be able to do that.

    Well, maybe not Jerick McKinnon, but anyone else.
    Thanks, Rastabot!
    www.247sports.com/porkchops

  10. #200

    Default Re: Option Offense

    Quote Originally Posted by Indy View Post
    I know that the coaches were excited and thought they had what they wanted at QB with the kid from Louisville, who was a big strong kid that could run and throw. He was not a Shai Werts type guy, but was the type guy they wanted to build the offense around. They thought he was gonna be really special. Maybe I've missed it, but there doesn't appear to be anyone on our recruiting radar like him. Correct me if that's wrong. We need to keep up the faith though because when we get that one "GUY" it will change everything.
    His medical condition HAD to be known during the recruiting cycle, or we probably don’t sign him.
    Thanks, Rastabot!
    www.247sports.com/porkchops

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